Income-splitting will give same-sex couples something to think about
Finance Minister Jim Flaherty is rumoured to be ready to introduce some form of income splitting for all Canadians in a legally recognized marriage.
Will this plan bring gays in larger numbers over to the Conservatives?
In Canada, gay couples can get married, a change to the definition of marriage made by Paul Martin's Liberal government and that was opposed by Stephen Harper and the Conservative Party.
Gay marriage is a reality in Canada, and is not likely to change. Nevertheless, many in the gay community continue to harbour bitterness towards the Conservative Party. For some, it goes far beyond marriage into general issues of right versus left, but consider those homosexual couples in which one partner earns a significantly greater wage than the other.
If the Conservatives make a move towards income splitting, these couples will benefit as much as a heterosexual couple. Perhaps even more since it unlikely children will factor in the family expenses. Will that cause some homosexuals, perhaps a significant number, to vote with their wallet?
What can the Liberals offer? They've already delivered on gay marriage. That fight is done with. If the Liberals think they can keep the gay vote by simply saying "We gave you marriage", they had better be ready with an answer to the question, "That's fine. But what are you going to do for me tomorrow?"
And that's what the Conservatives are going to have to do. They'll have to put the "progress" back into "progressive" and explain to the gay community that punishing the Tories for what happened in the past during the marriage debate then is foolish, considering the benefits that the Conservatives are offering all married couples in the future. I'm willing to bet that the gay community will split -- a sizable faction will see voting against the Conservatives as a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Of course, these votes will come disproportionately from the portion of the gay community that has the most to gain financially, meaning the most successful and best educated. If even a few can come out of the closet as it were and declare their support for the Conservatives, then I think conservatism in Canada will benefit greatly.
Opposition to gay marriage for many conservatives, including myself, was never about bigotry or hating gays or any of the other insults thrown at us during the debate. It was about the implications to the social fabric of this country by expanding the notion of marriage so much that it loses its most basic biological underpinning (as well as a suspicion that, for some proponents of gay marriage, it was less about marriage and more about punishing Christians in some way, as evidenced by some of the rhetoric heard from these particular gay marriage supporters). The consequences of that redefinition of marriage might not be felt for a long time, and there may well be no consequences of note at all, despite my fears to the contrary. But in the mean time, for an entire community to reject the Conservative Party is unhealthy. The gay community is no more homogenous politically speaking than any other group in Canada -- submerging that variety in political affiliation in order to push through gay marriage is a tactic that has long since served its purpose and is best abandoned.
Income-splitting might well be the issue that re-engages the gay community in broad debate in this country. That's a good thing.
Skew my story on Skewz.com
Rate political news for their bias, read related stories, and leave your own skewed commentary
Search for more opinions from Canadian bloggers on these related keywords
homosexuals same-sex marriage income splitting Jim Flaherty Canada Conservative Party Liberal Party Paul Martin Stephen Harper
Sphere presents related news articles and blog posts
Sphere It!
Comments
Income splitting will help gays and straights, blacks and whites, men and women, etc., etc. We've heard enough garbage from the left on this subject.
Nobody except bitter feminists are opposing this idea.
Posted by: William E. Demers at November 22, 2006 10:02 PM
Well then, take a long hard look at this. I quote this person from Garth Turner's blog who has done some calculations on how the splitting would benefit couples of different income levels.
"By my calculations I get the following:
At 50K a couple saves about 1200$
At 100K a couple saves about 3811$
At 200K a couple saves about 8063$
I used UFILE 2005 and kept everything very simple.
By jmccain on 11.22.06 5:51 pm "
This whole plan, as you can see, is a plan to benefit the rich as the Conservatives are famous for. SOMEBODY has to pay the taxes, and if the rich gets breaks, guess who gets to make up the difference?
Posted by: Marg at November 22, 2006 10:20 PM
Income splitting would be capped for individuals that make over $200,000 as the top marginal tax rate kicks in at $100,000 so there is a limit to how much the "rich" can benefit.
There always has been a penalty for single incomes with a stay at home mom- or is that a bad term today as well.
The conservatives should consider the income splitting for sure and also raise the minimum level where no tax is paid so that lower income people get some benefit that they would not get from income splitting.
By shrinking the tax revenues and giving money back to the people, it will give taxpayers more choice where to spend their money( not on beer and popcorn!) but the best part is that it reduces the amount of our money( the taxpayers) that they have to waste away on government programs that are not necessary.
This move would be very popular with middle class Canada-
Posted by: Peter at November 22, 2006 10:33 PM
So, Marg...
Perhaps you can tell us exactly how many couples in Canada make over $200K combined? And perhaps you could tell us exactly how much this will impact tax revenues as compared to the other two income brackets you mention, which more accurately reflect the great majority of Canadians? And perhaps you could you could truthfully analyze the blended net benefit of this strategy to Canadian couples?
I thought not.
Posted by: pheenster at November 23, 2006 01:49 AM
Marg bleats, "This whole plan, as you can see, is a plan to benefit the rich as the Conservatives are famous for." (Um, Prime Minister Stephen Harper is not a multi-millionaire, like ex-PMs Trudeau, Chretien, and Martin, nor are many of his cabinet ministers personally wealthy, or any that I know of, unlike many in the Liberal Party.
So, I don't know what you're talking about.
Also, the CPC has put programs in place to HELP lower income families, especially when it comes to daycare. Anyone who thinks that $100/child-under-six/month is insignificant has never lived on the one income my family has--or millions of other Canadian families. The Liberals were only interested in helping the very rich (their friends and often themselves) or the very narrow special interest groups they coddled, including the radical feminists who, BTW, do nothing without government funding, which is why they're fretting now. Other groups roll up their sleeves and work hard to forward their agendas WITHOUT government dollars.
A $1200 tax break for my familyh would be very welcome. How do we know that the families living on $100,000 or $200,000 aren't providing jobs for others? Marg must be a socialist who is envious of anyone who makes more money than her and her family, and wants to see an even split, whether it's deserved or not.
No thanks. Not in my Canada.
Posted by: 'been around the block at November 23, 2006 08:49 AM
Steve: They'll have to put the "progress" back into "progressive" and explain to the gay community that punishing the Tories for what happened in the past during the marriage debate then is foolish, considering the benefits that the Conservatives are offering all married couples in the future.
I dunno. The CPC's insistence on revisiting the same-sex marriage debate is only likely to reinforce within the the LGBTQ communities the perception that the Tory vision of Canada is incompatible with gay/lesbian rights. The often acrimonious debate was not merely something that "happened in the past." Uniting the "right" helped get PM Harper elected, but I suspect the Tories will find it increasingly difficult to appeal to the myriad interests of its diverse constituencies. The income-splitting thing may appeal to its fiscal conservative base (including middle- and upper-income bracket folks in the gay/lesbian communities), but the CPC's ongoing efforts to appeal to its social conservative base (via the SSM thing, among others) may drive those coveted gay/lesbian voters away just as quickly.
Opposition to gay marriage for many conservatives, including myself, was never about bigotry or hating gays or any of the other insults thrown at us during the debate. It was about the implications to the social fabric of this country by expanding the notion of marriage so much that it loses its most basic biological underpinning...
For better or for worse, in our day and age, sexual orientation--like gender/sex and race/ethnicity--is a core component of individual and group identity. Identity politics operates on at least two fronts: (1) preserving that group identity; and (2) being recognized, in society and in the law, as equal and legitimate and worthy. Identity-based advocacy movements are not amenable to distinctions like "I can tolerate your lifestyle, but also I think that your lifestyle, if granted the full spectrum of rights and legal status as my lifestyle, poses a threat to the social fabric of this country."
For the record, I'm not really opposed to income-splitting in principle, even though it's quite obvious that it benefits couples more than singles, single-income families more than dual-income families, and high-income families more than middle-income families. Also, I don't think basing it on # of kids is such a great idea. Two major caveat: I would oppose this income-splitting thing if (1) it is affordable federally only through the wholesale slashing of social programs; and/or (2) it becomes the only tax reform initiative on the agenda, displacing efforts aimed at, say, reducing the tax burden of truly low-income households.
Posted by: A at November 23, 2006 12:07 PM
Why is it that everytime a tax change that could benefit everyone is everyone concerned that it will be effect the rich more? I don't care about the rich, we don't live in the same world or have the same concerns for the most part. I care that it will effect me, that it may have some larger benefit for the rich and super-rich is irrelevant to me and a red herring. Do most people realize how easy is it for a low income (or low middle income) married couple to easily be seen by Revenue Canada earning above 50K? With most tax deductions really only available to the upper middle class (have you maxed out your RRSP deduction limit?, I didn't think so). With each year I see my taxes rise and very little I can do about it. A $1200 benefit? Bring it on, and thank you Prime Minister Harper for recognizing commited couples like no other government has for a very long time.
Posted by: William Ferris at November 23, 2006 01:52 PM
Some people don't know how to do taxes...like Marg. Income splitting has no benefit for the rich or the poor. It benefits families that earn more than the basic personal exemption and less than the top marginal tax rate. That's it.
This issue shows just how radical some people are. The fact that it benefits middle class families with one stay at home parent is just more than anti-conservatives can bear.
Posted by: PlaidShirt at November 23, 2006 04:00 PM
Hello again A,
This discussion is about income-splitting, not same-sex marriage, which I to am opposed to. But you brought up a point I have to comment on. Same-sex marriage to me is not about rights. I have no problem with same-sex couples enjoying the same rights. What I oppose is redefining the word ‘marriage’ to do it. If one of the centuries-old criteria can be negotiated then why can’t the others. And our courts don’t need to hear arguments from wing-nuts for the definition of marriage to change to ‘legalize’ things like polygamy, bigamy, incest and so on. The Charter, flawed as it is, will encourage such arguments. That we have changed the definition will only encourage this nonsense. My second reason for opposing it stems from the fear that some day a clergy member will be facing a discrimination charge. Whatever Parliament says about protecting clergy, the Charter is designed to allow people to say things like ‘my right to get ‘married’ in a place of worship by clergy supersedes your right to practice your faith.’
Truly low-income households pay very little in tax. Rich people pay over 50% of their total income in various taxes and surtaxes and provide services and jobs to every other class. The arguments that they should pay more, or not pay a bit less are foolish and short-sighted. They are the ones who are best able to vote with their feet and go to another country.
Marg,
Your view of taxes and the economy is very simplistic and linear. When you write that ‘SOMEBODY has to pay the taxes’ you assume that there is no tax benefit to leaving money in taxpayer’s pockets. With respect to taxation, we are well beyond the point of diminishing returns. It is counter intuitive, but LOWERING taxes can indeed bring the same or more money into government coffers. It’s a basic concept of economics that you clearly haven’t seen yet. But that’s ok, neither have the NDP, or the Liberals who took us to this point of over-taxation.
Posted by: Gargoyle at November 24, 2006 09:53 AM
Doctor Who takes three prizes at the National Television Awards in a repeat of its success last year...
Posted by: Brice Hodgson at April 17, 2007 03:55 AM
Alec Baldwin asks for his voice to be removed from an "unfair" documentary about Arnold Schwarzenegger...
Posted by: Tobias Mccurry at April 27, 2007 03:20 AM
The Red Hot Chili Peppers are leading the way at this years MTV Europe music awards with four nominations...
Posted by: Easton Graff at April 27, 2007 03:32 AM
Borat creator Sacha Baron Cohen reportedly signs a $42.5m (£22m) film deal starring his character Bruno...
Posted by: Joseph Utley at April 27, 2007 03:41 AM
TV host Oprah Winfrey gives audience members $1,000 (£526) each to donate to a charitable cause...
Posted by: Ethen Smoot at April 27, 2007 03:47 AM
Jonathan Ross is dubbed "risque" by Ofcom but not in breach of rules over an interview with David Cameron...
Posted by: Emmanuel Popp at April 27, 2007 04:03 AM
Pioneering screenwriter Nigel Kneale, best known for the Quatermass TV serials and films, dies aged 84...
Posted by: Easton Mcknight at April 27, 2007 04:12 AM
Jonathan Ross is dubbed "risque" by Ofcom but not in breach of rules over an interview with David Cameron...
Posted by: Adolfo Kiser at April 27, 2007 04:23 AM
Pop trio Atomic Kitten will reform to play a concert in support of jailed Liverpool football fan Michael Shields...
Posted by: Ronan Gibbons at April 27, 2007 04:31 AM
Social networking site MySpace is to block users from uploading copyrighted music to its pages...
Posted by: Luciano Johns at April 27, 2007 04:38 AM
Doctor Who takes three prizes at the National Television Awards in a repeat of its success last year...
Posted by: Eduardo Vallejo at April 27, 2007 04:45 AM
A musical about the witches from The Wizard of Oz breaks West End box office records, its producers say...
Posted by: Graham Roque at April 27, 2007 04:51 AM
The Rolling Stones postpone a show in the US to allow singer Sir Mick Jagger time to rest his voice...
Posted by: Bernard Hutchinson at April 27, 2007 04:59 AM
TV host Oprah Winfrey gives audience members $1,000 (£526) each to donate to a charitable cause...
Posted by: Johnathan Brinkley at April 27, 2007 05:07 AM
Veteran game show host Bob Barker is stepping down from hosting The Price is Right after 35 years...
Posted by: Damion Stanford at April 27, 2007 05:13 AM
Jonathan Ross is dubbed "risque" by Ofcom but not in breach of rules over an interview with David Cameron...
Posted by: Wesley Cutler at April 27, 2007 05:27 AM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Zakary Arrington at April 27, 2007 05:45 AM
Alec Baldwin asks for his voice to be removed from an "unfair" documentary about Arnold Schwarzenegger...
Posted by: Francis Schramm at April 27, 2007 05:59 AM
Microsoft and Peter Jackson postpone the making of a film based on the Halo video game after backers pull out...
Posted by: Isaac Farr at April 27, 2007 06:22 AM
Colombia's vice president is "baffled" by Kate Moss's success following cocaine allegations...
Posted by: Gary Weldon at April 27, 2007 06:29 AM
TV host Oprah Winfrey gives audience members $1,000 (£526) each to donate to a charitable cause...
Posted by: Cameron Prosser at April 27, 2007 06:52 AM
Microsoft and Peter Jackson postpone the making of a film based on the Halo video game after backers pull out...
Posted by: Milton Behrens at April 27, 2007 07:01 AM
The first stage of a £150m investment in regional museums is praised for boosting visitor numbers...
Posted by: Rocco Casper at April 27, 2007 07:29 AM
Pop trio Atomic Kitten will reform to play a concert in support of jailed Liverpool football fan Michael Shields...
Posted by: Howard Hildreth at April 27, 2007 07:35 AM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Milton Cole at April 27, 2007 07:50 AM
The Rolling Stones cancel a gig in Hawaii and postpone other tour dates as Mick Jagger suffers throat troubles...
Posted by: German Pettigrew at April 27, 2007 08:07 AM
The Rolling Stones cancel a gig in Hawaii and postpone other tour dates as Mick Jagger suffers throat troubles...
Posted by: Jaquan Mauro at April 27, 2007 08:12 AM
The Red Hot Chili Peppers are leading the way at this years MTV Europe music awards with four nominations...
Posted by: Alijah Stanford at April 27, 2007 08:20 AM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Rylan Sun at April 27, 2007 08:27 AM
TV host Oprah Winfrey gives audience members $1,000 (£526) each to donate to a charitable cause...
Posted by: Braeden Morey at April 27, 2007 08:47 AM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Shannon Grubbs at April 27, 2007 11:02 AM
The Rolling Stones postpone a show in the US to allow singer Sir Mick Jagger time to rest his voice...
Posted by: Travon Baines at April 27, 2007 12:16 PM
The judge who put coded messages in his Da Vinci Code plagiarism trial ruling has written another...
Posted by: Cooper Grimes at April 27, 2007 01:41 PM
Social networking site MySpace is to block users from uploading copyrighted music to its pages...
Posted by: Nasir Crouch at April 27, 2007 02:00 PM
Borat creator Sacha Baron Cohen reportedly signs a $42.5m (£22m) film deal starring his character Bruno...
Posted by: Steve Chin at April 27, 2007 03:26 PM
Madonna says she may adopt another child from abroad following her proposed adoption of a Malawian boy...
Posted by: Roman Thibodeau at April 27, 2007 03:54 PM
The first stage of a £150m investment in regional museums is praised for boosting visitor numbers...
Posted by: Jorden Eldridge at April 27, 2007 04:05 PM
The Red Hot Chili Peppers are leading the way at this years MTV Europe music awards with four nominations...
Posted by: Travon Prichard at April 27, 2007 04:12 PM
Veteran game show host Bob Barker is stepping down from hosting The Price is Right after 35 years...
Posted by: Jeremy Wilt at April 27, 2007 04:21 PM
Microsoft and Peter Jackson postpone the making of a film based on the Halo video game after backers pull out...
Posted by: Tyree Belanger at April 27, 2007 04:29 PM
The first stage of a £150m investment in regional museums is praised for boosting visitor numbers...
Posted by: Humberto Fairchild at April 27, 2007 04:37 PM
Alec Baldwin asks for his voice to be removed from an "unfair" documentary about Arnold Schwarzenegger...
Posted by: Miguel Ketchum at April 27, 2007 04:45 PM
Colombia's vice president is "baffled" by Kate Moss's success following cocaine allegations...
Posted by: Draven Parent at April 27, 2007 04:54 PM
A musical about the witches from The Wizard of Oz breaks West End box office records, its producers say...
Posted by: Sheldon Nobles at April 27, 2007 05:05 PM
Classical singer Russell Watson postpones his forthcoming UK tour after undergoing brain surgery...
Posted by: Anderson Pinson at April 27, 2007 05:14 PM
Madonna says she may adopt another child from abroad following her proposed adoption of a Malawian boy...
Posted by: Coby Devore at April 27, 2007 05:22 PM
The first stage of a £150m investment in regional museums is praised for boosting visitor numbers...
Posted by: Felipe Damon at April 27, 2007 05:31 PM
Alec Baldwin asks for his voice to be removed from an "unfair" documentary about Arnold Schwarzenegger...
Posted by: Neil Siler at April 27, 2007 05:41 PM
The Red Hot Chili Peppers are leading the way at this years MTV Europe music awards with four nominations...
Posted by: Jeremiah Campbell at April 27, 2007 06:02 PM
Pop trio Atomic Kitten will reform to play a concert in support of jailed Liverpool football fan Michael Shields...
Posted by: Taylor Ramon at April 27, 2007 06:35 PM
Veteran game show host Bob Barker is stepping down from hosting The Price is Right after 35 years...
Posted by: Nolan Devries at April 27, 2007 06:40 PM
Alec Baldwin asks for his voice to be removed from an "unfair" documentary about Arnold Schwarzenegger...
Posted by: Isaak Oates at April 27, 2007 06:47 PM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Jabari Sammons at April 27, 2007 06:54 PM
Borat creator Sacha Baron Cohen reportedly signs a $42.5m (£22m) film deal starring his character Bruno...
Posted by: Pierre Newman at April 27, 2007 07:00 PM
The Rolling Stones cancel a gig in Hawaii and postpone other tour dates as Mick Jagger suffers throat troubles...
Posted by: Kelton Groves at April 27, 2007 07:07 PM
Veteran game show host Bob Barker is stepping down from hosting The Price is Right after 35 years...
Posted by: Jasper Waterman at April 27, 2007 07:13 PM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Tyrell Fitzgerald at April 27, 2007 07:32 PM
The Rolling Stones cancel a gig in Hawaii and postpone other tour dates as Mick Jagger suffers throat troubles...
Posted by: Maddox Fielder at April 27, 2007 07:42 PM
Jonathan Ross is dubbed "risque" by Ofcom but not in breach of rules over an interview with David Cameron...
Posted by: Dion Mills at April 27, 2007 08:16 PM
Jonathan Ross is dubbed "risque" by Ofcom but not in breach of rules over an interview with David Cameron...
Posted by: Keenan Janes at April 27, 2007 08:24 PM
The judge who put coded messages in his Da Vinci Code plagiarism trial ruling has written another...
Posted by: Zack Silva at April 27, 2007 08:32 PM
Veteran actor William Franklyn, known for voicing the 1960s Schweppes TV adverts, dies aged 81...
Posted by: Desmond Shannon at April 27, 2007 08:42 PM
Social networking site MySpace is to block users from uploading copyrighted music to its pages...
Posted by: Tate Wolf at April 27, 2007 08:49 PM
Madonna says she may adopt another child from abroad following her proposed adoption of a Malawian boy...
Posted by: Francis Hargis at April 27, 2007 08:57 PM
Pop trio Atomic Kitten will reform to play a concert in support of jailed Liverpool football fan Michael Shields...
Posted by: Baby Atherton at April 27, 2007 09:05 PM
William Styron, whose Holocaust novel Sophie's Choice became a film and an opera, has died, aged 81...
Posted by: Blake Sturdivant at April 27, 2007 09:13 PM
Madonna says she may adopt another child from abroad following her proposed adoption of a Malawian boy...
Posted by: Ronan Mattson at April 27, 2007 09:22 PM
Microsoft and Peter Jackson postpone the making of a film based on the Halo video game after backers pull out...
Posted by: Wyatt Singh at April 27, 2007 09:31 PM
Social networking site MySpace is to block users from uploading copyrighted music to its pages...
Posted by: Gage Quarles at April 27, 2007 09:45 PM
Jonathan Ross is dubbed "risque" by Ofcom but not in breach of rules over an interview with David Cameron...
Posted by: Zane Kohn at April 27, 2007 09:55 PM
 
|
|
